About three years ago, I briefly outlined my experiences with religion. I haven’t had good experiences with most denominations, the worst experiences being with Baptists (in churches from both the Southern Baptist Convention and the Texas General Baptist Convention) and with a small local Quaker church. In both of those denominations, I found people who despised me because I asked questions, I looked different, and because my parents were from two different ethnic groups and two different religious backgrounds. I was called “evil,” told I was “going to hell,” that I was a “sinner,” and that I was “despised by God.” I also encountered pastors who had bizarre notions of what certain Biblical passages REALLY meant. To be fair, some of those notions were based on what the congregation wanted to hear, but in my opinion that makes them all the worse because those pastors were willing to sell out their own faith in order to appease a crowd, rather than actually preaching the word of God.
Now, some random guy has found that entry and seen fit to “feel sorry” for me because I didn’t have good experiences with Baptists. His logic appears to be thus: He’s had good experiences with Baptist churches, and he truly believes that he’s found the truth in them. Because my experiences were negative and I DIDN’T find truth with Baptists, then I must be either lying or exaggerating.
As I mentioned in my reply, do kindly remember that these are my life experiences, not yours. You simply cannot universalize your own experiences and accuse others of lying when what they’ve experienced differs vastly from what you’ve experienced.
As a follow up to that post, I feel it’s necessary to mention that I’ve since embraced atheism (at best I can admit to agnosticism–I don’t know, and you can’t make me know!) and rejected religion. Yes, it’s true. A lifetime of rational thinking applied to the Bible and religion in general has led me to believe that God is just as real as Santa Claus. Strangely, I don’t feel any less moral than I did before I turned away from religion. In fact, now that the burden of morality is entirely on me, I think I feel even more moral. I can’t blame Jesus or Satan any time I do something–now, I bear the full responsibility of my actions. I do miss not being able to foist my sins on Satan (“The devil made me do it!”) or Jesus (“Jesus already forgave me. Why can’t you?”), but that’s a small price to pay.
There. I’ve said it. You may commence your useless attempts at saving my soul from the fires of your nonexistent Hell.
Evil Homer Image Credit: Culture Kills (which I’ve added to my Blogroll…of doom)
Well said.
That guy is a douche – and reminds me of my family. Bleah.
Welcome to the family.
Aaah, atheism. I’m actually more moral and behave better than many of my believing counterparts. I’m not the one making racist or sexist or homophobic comments all the time. And I don’t need God to tell me not to.
Becoming an atheist was one of the most liberating experiences of my life. I’m not speaking just about the freedom from church, religion, and having to worry about keeping my invisible omnipotent buddy happy. It finally left me at peace with all those nagging doubts I’d had over the years — which made me realize there had always been an atheist inside me, struggling to get out. It was, ironically, the best step towards true spiritual happiness I ever took.
As brian said: welcome to the family!
While I’m not an atheist, I do feel compelled to support you to an extent in your application of the gift of free will, choice, and personal belief. I believe people confuse religion with God. I do believe in God, but have to object to organized religion.
I don’t remember anywhere in the Bible God saying that what He/She is and does isn’t good enough so we as humans have to help Him/Her determine who and what is good and bad. I don’t know the Bible (or similar works) very well, but I really don’t remember anywhere in the New Testament Jesus saying we had to complete a checklist, conform to a certain lifestyle, contribute financially to a particular non-profit organization a certain portion of our income, or judge everyone who wasn’t exactly like us in order to get into Heaven or even have a happy life down here on Mother Earth.
The guy on the cross (not Jesus, the other one that had a small, but memorable one-liner in the Passion Play) was being killed for his vile crimes. He was possibly a homosexual, alcoholic, drug addict, wife batterer, pedaphile, and/or a slew of other things that Baptists and other members of the infinite number of pietistic groups would say are unworthy souls and not viable candidates for acceptance into the Great Beyond. But did Jesus (also known as Jehovah, Allah, Creator, or whatever name suits you) care? No, he did not. He did not ask the man to show cancelled checks for what he put in the offering plate last Sunday. He did not ask for a detailed summary of the guy’s lineage and family medical history. He did not question the guy’s choice in tailor or stylist. He did not ask the guy to complete an application, submit a resume and financial statement, or even schedule him for an interview. He simply said, and I paraphrase, “Dude, see you on the other side!”
What confuses me is that somehow between that point in time and approximately 1975 years later we have confused what what God wants and expects in people with what people want and expect in other people. Now, I’m not ashamed to say I believe in Jesus, and I don’t think anyone should be ashamed in professing their beliefs in anything. I love it when someone’s says they’re an atheist and then uses terms like “Good God” and “Thank God” and “What the Hell” in their blogs. It lets me know that their name for God is simply not established yet. They believe in something and know they have a purpose in life and believe in treating others with respect and accepting everyone for who they are. They enjoy exercising their free will and share their opinions without shame or guilt or worry. Holy Shit! I think atheists are Christians and they just don’t know it! It’s the “Christians”, the ones that Jesus threw out of the temple and turned his back on, that are confused. They think they believe in God, but actually are suffering from what my mom used call the “Queen of the Mermaids” syndrome. They think they’re right and everyone else is wrong and parade around like their shit don’t stink and we should all strive to be like them one day. I’m sorry, but I can’t live like that. One, I have more vices and faults than the entire cast of Melrose Place put together. Also, I couldn’t be friends with anyone because I don’t know any perfect people (and if they know me, neither do they!). I screw up on a constant basis. I wake up every morning with the best of intentions, make some good and bad choices during the day, and go to bed at night happy that I survived my own stupidity, as well as that of others. I say my favorite prayer (“God, You Know, Amen”) and go to sleep knowing that I have a 50/50 chance I’m going to get to do it all over again tomorrow. And you know what? I’m happy. I have peace in my heart, and I enjoy being here on the green globe.
Do I think atheism is wrong? No. Do I think the belief in God is wrong? No. Do I think being a judgmental, hypocritical, snotty, heartless asshole is wrong? Yes. Do I really care what you think? I’d like to say no, but then if I didn’t get a rise out of somebody, why the hell bother submitting my comment?
Thanks for sharing your opinions and reminding us that we do have the gift of free will and choice. Remember, God loves you!
Cousin Terri Bathtub made some excellent points. Religion and spirituality are poles apart in my mind. Do I believe in God? Yes, I do. But the word “Christian” has taken on such a negative definition in my head, that sometimes I am afraid of people who proudly proclaim their “Christianity” and I think they are just using the word for their own advancement somehow. And I know I have been a “Christian” who has hurt people, too, and I am definitely not perfect. The “church” is so secular these days, it’s hard to know what its role is now, anyway. But I do believe in God, and I believe in forgiveness (and hope people forgive ME…) and healing, personal gifts from God (like your incredible writing and musical talents!), and eternal life through Christ. Terri Bathtub’s mom used to say “If you’ve got to advertise that you’re a Christian instead of living it, something’s wrong.” I think that’s where “religion” is seriously messing up. Everything is a media event now. Every church feels a need to have a “Family Life Center” (gym) or build a “bigger and better” worship structure. It’s become more about “marketing” Christ rather than living it. I’m not saying all churches are bad. I’m just saying that I can see why people fall away – in droves. In my journey, I am trying to get back to the basics. I screw up a lot. But I feel I am loved by God – and I know this by things I see every day. Like my mother, almost 79 and still going strong and still loving God in spite of the life she was dealt at 41. Like the lunar eclipse the other night. WOW! Like this blog, which has given us an opportunity to discuss!
Anyway, I love you. You are magnificent. You have energy and talents that are rare. And whether you believe in God or not, I will always consider YOU a gift from God, Mim. BTW, your blog rocks.
I am fairly certain that most people do not spent a whole lot of time pondering over the actual meaning of their religious doctrines or worrying about any inconsistencies of their faith. They go to meet their family and friends, and thus the church does provide a form of community. The main draw back of being an atheist is that there is no organized community of atheists which can provide the same type of community activities as found in a church. Once someone is out of school, meeting new people and making new friends is more difficult. Certainly one’s work environment can provide an opportunity to meet people, and there are service groups (for example boy or girl scouts, if you have children) which can be joined. Its just that without a church, you have to work harder.
I’ve been to a dozen different churches and denominations in my quests over the past 30 years around here, and I’ve never experienced anything you describe. Nobody ever talked that way to me. Maybe you have a nasty attitude or something.
Welcome to the moral agnostic/atheist club.
There are Free Thought Associations in Houston where you would be welcome. Of course, you would also be very welcome at Unitarian Universalist congregations. One of their theologians came to exactly the same conclusion a few decades ago, most of the atheists he knew were better moral Christians than many of the Christians.
Rebel Yell & others,
I have a non-Biblical quote to share:
“The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting; it has been found difficult and left untried.”
–G.K. Chesterton
Jesus has asked us to love our neighbor and so I’m here to not save your soul, but say that only the truth can set you free. It’s unfortunate (to say the least) of your past experiences. Just remember that humans are imperfect, only God is perfect. What His son, Jesus, did was establish a Church so the Gates of Hell will not prevail against Her.
What is taught is absolute truth to an imperfect soul such as myself. I may stumble in following the teachings of Jesus that is taught by the Church, but I dust myself up and try again.
Remember, If there were no God, there would be no atheists (again Chesterton).
And with that I part with this quote (again):
“To one who has faith, no explanation is necessary. To one without faith, no explanation is possible.”
–St. Thomas Aquinas
Tito the Catholic
Doesn’t this make your domain name kind of ironic now?
Yes, but my domain was always ironic. Before, though, it was an inside joke that nobody got.